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 Saturday Night Multi-class racing

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RIP_3-Diamonds
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PostSubject: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Fri May 31 2013, 23:24

So, I have given it some thought, and am now going to lay out my idea for a new series for Saturday nights. I'm posting this up now, so that everyone has a chance to see it here. I will also send out invites via PM through PSN.

This will be a multi-class racing series with 3 classes of cars racing during the same event. The thought is that everyone can choose a class to race in what they feel most comfortable with. So those who feel that the top class would be a bit much to deal with can run in a lower class. Those who feel that they want to push themselves can try the top class.

I hope that everyone can find something in the 3 classes to be offered. These will be racing cars ranging in PP from 585 to 720. 650 will be the middle class. Tire choice will be open to facilitate strategic choices. These will be long races, 150 miles each track, spanning 4 weeks beginning June 8th. Once you make your class choice, you will be in the hunt for that class championship. I would prefer that you stay in the same car through-out the series. If this is a success, we will do more, and you can then choose another car or class to race/run in.

Any questions can be posted here, and I will help clarify any issues you may have. I hope to see a great turn-out, and look forward to kicking off what I hope will be a fun, and popular, summer series.

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DeadMansHand
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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Fri May 31 2013, 23:47

Looks like it's really time to get to our own Gt1, 2 & 3 clasifications .


I'll start on the low end of the race cars and get some solid times for comparison. let's decide on a track to compare cars so we are close. I'm thinking either Tskuba, IRC or Grand Valley (east or full).

Sounds great 3.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Sat Jun 01 2013, 00:06

Opps, you might want to take a look at what I just posted dead. I think it'll all make sense once people start to see it. How about we use tomorrow to run a test and tune?

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Sat Jun 01 2013, 10:22

Cool, sir. I shall meet you on the tarmac.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Sat Jun 01 2013, 15:42

Great, I hope we can get a few to join us tonight. Maybe we can run this reconnaissance in an open lobby. My thoughts for the enforcement of the PP levels are quite simple. Ask all 585 to blue up, they stay in, ask all 650 to blue up, they stay in, and have the 720 go in last.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Sun Jun 02 2013, 22:09

I like this idea 3d. Hope I can join in asap!
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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Mon Jun 03 2013, 20:16

Absolutely Poke! Our Saturday test went well with the cars having distinct character for each class. Remember, pick a class and choose a car to run. Get in some good testing, each class will be tough! Wink

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Sun Jun 09 2013, 00:19

So far, so good! I was pleased to have at least 3 cars in each class. I know some may have felt that they were un-prepared, but in the end, it looked like everyone had a chance to run what they liked.

I will go ahead and allow car changes for those who want to use another car for the next race. I would prefer we all stay in the same class for the rest of the weeks. There will be three more races, at which point we can all decide to switch into whatever we want. You do not, however, have to switch if you would like to stick with what you have been using.

Thanks to all of those who participated tonight, I hope everyone had a good time. If you missed it, please join us next week for more multi-class racing!

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Sun Jun 09 2013, 20:19

Hey 3d, Guys this has the potential to be a great series. It was fun negotiating the traffic of the different race classes. I know i have been absent for a while, but im back online & racing.

3D my only suggestion would be to use the slowest first grid, so that it can make things really interesting by having the fastest class start at the back. Also i think u should consider lowering both the 650pp & 720pp class by 10pp respectively as there are a number of race cars that belong in the class, but just cant make it to the pp margin. This should be done in the interest of equal performance & fairness.

Glad to be back guys, hope to be more involved again. Add me up if u removed me from ur psn friend list.
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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Mon Jun 10 2013, 07:38

Well, with full damage on, it could get a bit ugly at the start of the races for the 720 to begin in the back. For the next set of races, we could play around with the class PP to add more flavor to the races. That wouldn't be a bad idea at all.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Mon Jun 10 2013, 08:59

I can say as a 585 car last week, I felt just fine starting at the back. With the first turn at GP-F like it is and the braking differences between the classes, I think there could have been a disaster. While cornering speeds are close, the closing speeds are very high. I got myself into trouble once just trying to stay out of the way of faster cars.

Playing with PP levels is all good. The Dodge Challenger SRT-8 TC didn't seem to fit well in any class. The fan car, the Chaperal, might need to be discussed. It seemed to be untouchable, which is what I've found using it in the seasonal events.

Good stuff. Hope we can keep big, diverse rooms like last week.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Mon Jun 10 2013, 14:22

all good . just two things . the prototypes really need the traction control. and do we need very fast tire wear . it really handicaps the faster cars wich are lighter but chew tires up due to higher conering speeds . just stuff to think about . the prototypes use tc in real life , can we use it in the series ?
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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Mon Jun 10 2013, 19:43

U know what ive been away waaaaaaayyyyy too long to be giving suggestions lol. My only reason for mentioning the reverse grid, is to add early excitement of negotiating the traffic, instead of waiting to lap someone or be lapped. which probably wouldn't happen between the 585 & 650pp class. Worrying about early collisions due to the grid & heavy damage is a glass half empty way of looking at it, if so then damage should be put to light.
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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Mon Jun 10 2013, 19:53

Hmm, the TC is a bit of a touchy subject. We already allowed driving line, and now TC? What's next, SRF?

At the risk of sounding like a jerk, I would resist drivers aids until it turns into a real problem. One of the neat things about the heavies burning through tires, it gives you something to think about in terms of race pace. There is qualifying pace, and there is race pace. Knowing how to manage the tires until you know when to come in for fuel, and thus can waste them as you see fit, is part of the dynamic I'm going for here.

150 mile races are long enough to get a feel on how to conserve, and push, various tire compounds. Not every lap needs to be a qualifying burner. If I had the fuel, I would had taken 585 even though my best laps on softs were 2 seconds slower than ZZZ's.

With tire wear on fast, it gives us the ability to have at least three stints to plan for. If it were just normal, the hards could last 20+ laps.

Thanks for the input. I hope I have been helpful in addressing any concerns you guys may have had.

And yes, the Chapprell will be gone from the series. We can use the remaining weeks to get acclimated to the series rules and flow.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Mon Jun 10 2013, 20:02

To the other points, 1ej i have to disagree on the TC thing lol. Yes the LMP's were very much a handful & required total concentration, but they should. I had a few spills from running on hards but with some patience they were reduced significantly. I wasnt aware @ the time that tire wear was on very fast. it was rough on the LMP's, hence the reason for me using hard tires lol. Lastly the Chapparel 2J should really only be raced against other 60's race cars, because for some strange reason its not as dominant, especially against the Jaguar XJR13. Against anything else it just does not belong. In the GT community the 2J & the suzuki gsx r4 are known as "cheat cars" only because there are in a class by itself.
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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Mon Jun 10 2013, 20:14

The tire wear was on fast, not very fast. And trust me, the first time people get run over , however unintentionally it is, there will be some sore feelings. The only way I think something like that could work, is to stagger the starts for each class. Let 585 go at flag, send 650 later, then 'release the hounds'.... Twisted Evil

It's not really a pessimistic way of looking at it Joker, more of a realistic way of setting the grid.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Mon Jun 10 2013, 21:25

As far as I'm aware, most mixed class racing start with their respective classes grouped. I also believe that ALMS staggers their groups, but have the fast cars first.

I have become wary of inverted starts, and remember, I have used them on several series. It would certianly add a twist to the 720 race. I would most certianly agree with at least a 10 second staggered start. I would hate to ruin a guy's night just because I can't get moving enough.


Up to you, 3. I shall race what I am given.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Tue Jun 11 2013, 07:38

We can re-visit the grid issue later. For now, lets stick with it like we have it.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Tue Jun 11 2013, 23:51

My suggestion for the slowest first grid was merely to increase the fun factor of the race. Gran Turismo hasnt reached a point where multi class racing is a designed option, so as a racing community we are doing this on the fly. The pp issue is the only glaring defect that needs to be adjusted, Im perfectly fine with 3d's settings. I mean i know s*** happens in a race, but we've been playing this game wayyyy too long, to be dealing with the same issues over & over & over again.
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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Wed Jun 12 2013, 19:23

Well, I know it may seem that the PP is a touch high right now. I'll make it a little lower for the next pair of races after Monza.

 As to the grid setting, one of the things I'm trying to avoid is the same old problems associated with the faster cars having to overtake the lower classes. No matter how much running we may have together, there WILL be incidents that are avoidable. Being in the faster car doesn't automatically give a driver the right to blow past ANYWHERE on the track. That driver needs to tuck in when it's in a corner, and pull out and away down the straight.

 By the same token, the slower car needs to understand that the faster car is just that, FASTER. Let it by and resume the race. Don't just think that it can wait until the whole track is clear, if it's in a duel, it'll be awfully anxious to get past as soon as possible.

 By alleviating the initial jockeying for position at the start of the race, I'm hoping that the 3 separate races will be relatively trouble free at the start. Thanks for the input Joker, I can always count on you to alert me to problems you see.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Thu Jun 13 2013, 01:14

i know all about pacing and saving tires 3D . but i checked the room settings to change them when you left and tire wear was on very fast . maby just a oversight on your part . even on hards i had to pit every 10 laps softs only got six . the combination of VF tire wear and full damage just seems over the top for a event thats supposed to be fun .
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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Thu Jun 13 2013, 07:54

Hmm, indeed that would had been an oversight scratch I'll be more cautious on that setting next time. That certainly was not the intent.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturday Night Multi-class racing   Thu Jun 13 2013, 12:34

Yeah, we were shooting for 3 stops in the race instead of 4. Course, I had 6 stops, but 2 of them were for my own stupidity.

still, first race in the series. The bugs can get worked out.

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